From the U.S. Government Accountability Office, www.gao.gov Transcript for: FEMA's Wildfire Response and Recovery Description: We're talking about FEMA's response and recovery efforts for wildfires, and the unique challenges they present. Related GAO Work: GAO-20-5: Wildfire Disasters: FEMA Could Take Additional Actions to Address Unique Response and Recovery Challenges Released: October 2019 [ Background Music ] [ Chris Currie: ] Wildfires are likely to burn longer, destroy more houses and infrastructure, and affect more people in the future. [ Matt Oldham: ] Welcome to GAO's Watchdog Report, your source for news and information from the US Government Accountability Office. I'm Matt Oldham. In 2017 and 2018, wildfires in California killed 159 people and destroyed more than 30,000 buildings. And recent environmental assessments say fire seasons are getting longer, which could put more people and property at risk. With me is Chris Currie, a GAO Homeland Security and Justice director, to talk about FEMA's response to, and recovery from, wildfires. Thanks for joining me, Chris. [ Chris Currie: ] Thank you. [ Matt Oldham: ] So Chris, what can you tell me about FEMA's role in the aftermath of the 2017 and 2018 wildfires? [ Chris Currie: ] FEMA played a huge role in the recent wildfires, and really has always provided support to state, local, and tribal governments after these types of events, but what's really changed recently is that we're seeing these fires become much larger and more severe, and they're hitting more populated areas. For example, the 2018 Camp Fire. That's the one that destroyed the city of Paradise, California, everyone probably remembers from the news, was the worst in California's entire history. So, unfortunately, 85 people lost their lives in that one fire, and over 18,000 structures were destroyed. So, with more people and structures affected, a lot of FEMA's response and recovery programs are coming into play, where they didn't in the past. Now, what we heard when we talked to state, local, and federal officials is generally very positive views about FEMA's coordination with state and local governments and their response support. For example, officials talked about FEMA helping them to shelter survivors, setting up disaster recovery centers, and registering survivors quickly for all sorts of assistance. [ Matt Oldham: ] So, were there any challenges for FEMA, then, after those fires? [ Chris Currie: ] Oh, yes. Absolutely. So, wildfire response and recovery has a number of very unique challenges that we don't see in other disasters, like hurricanes and flooding. Actually, that was the title of our report, related to the unique challenges. For example, removing debris is a key first step after any disaster, but wildfire debris is very unique. Unlike hurricane or flooding debris, the fire creates toxic debris that has to be handled specially, before rebuilding can happen in an area. So, the scale and the amount of this type of toxic debris and what had to be done with it really caught everyone off guard, since this hasn't been encountered at this level before. The housing shortages were another huge challenge. So, typically in a federally declared disaster, FEMA provides short-term housing options to survivors, like mobile homes, trailers, rental houses, or hotels. However, many of the typical options didn't work. For example, in California, they already have a huge housing shortage and very high rental and housing prices, so just weren't many options to house survivors. So, FEMA had to look at alternative options, like campgrounds and group facilities and things like that. [ Background Music ] [ Matt Oldham: ] So, it sounds like there were some specific challenges that FEMA faces after wildfires. You've got your toxic debris. You've got, in the case of the California wildfires, housing shortages. So, Chris, has FEMA been keeping track of some of the lessons they've learned from the challenges they've seen? [ Chris Currie: ] FEMA has done some after-action reporting on lessons learned, but what they haven't done is comprehensively assess their policies and programs to account for the unique challenges they're going to face moving forward. We actually recommended that they do this, because these challenges are so unique. And we also felt it very important, because as you said in the opening, the length and severity of wildfires and the seasons are predicted to increase. Also, the development and the population growth near high-risk areas is still only increasing, and all of these point to the fact that FEMA is likely to be responding to, and helping states recover from, these types of events more and more in the future. [ Matt Oldham: ] Is there anything else FEMA can do to better prepare their recovery and response efforts for future wildfires? [ Chris Currie: ] Well, I think that one thing in our recommendation for them to look at their policies and programs is how certain programs may need to be tailored towards the unique aspects of fire, and I talked a little bit about this with housing. Some of the housing options for survivors after a disaster are just not doable after a fire, so looking at how their programs need to be tailored for fires, I think, is a key part of our recommendation. [ Matt Oldham: ] So, last question. What is the bottom line of this report? [ Chris Currie: ] Well, the bottom line is that wildfires are likely to burn longer, destroy more houses and infrastructure, and affect more people in the future. We can't treat 2017 and 2018 as outliers or anomalies. We have to prepare to respond and recover more frequently from these types of fires in the future. [ Matt Oldham: ] Chris Currie was talking about a GAO report on FEMA's response and recovery challenges for wildfire disasters. Thank you for your time, Chris. [ Chris Currie: ] Thank you. [ Background Music ] [ Matt Oldham: ] And thank you for listening to the Watchdog Report. To hear more podcasts, subscribe to us on Apple Podcasts. For more from the congressional watchdog, the US Government Accountability Office, visit us at gao.gov.